I was afraid to swap the wires on the timer because I don’t fully understand how it works. I’m confident it’s wired correctly because it’s worked that way since I’ve owned the car for the past 3 years. I still suspect the timer even though every one says they have never seen an intermittent timer. I also don’t think it’s a bad crimp because I wiggled the s##t out of those wires and my meter didn’t budge. That green wire had 12 volts until I plugged it back into the timer. Don’t recall exactly what the reading was but when the wire was put back on the timer the voltage dropped way down (maybe around 3 volts but I’m not sure) and the relay stopped working. Did this about 3 or 4 times with the same result then magically everything started to work. The only other thing I touched was the adjustment on the timer. At this point I have it turned down to the least amount of time. About 2 seconds after the key is turned off. It’s impossible to diagnose a problem when it’s not doing it so I put everything back together with the old DC to DC converter. I will drive around and see how it goes. If it happens again at least I now know how to unplug the timer or bypass the relay to get home. I would eliminate the timer if I knew how. It’s a useless feature. I can’t thank you guys enough for all of your help, suggestions and wiring diagrams. Your obviously not going to post your address on here but if there’s a way of sending me a private message I would like to send you both a little something for all of your help. Thanks again and stay safe.
I agree. If the timer had internal short, such as diodes or caps, it would short circuit 12v circuit and shut down dc-dc converter.
Should blow a fuse, but the short circuit protection in converter may be faster.
I’ve seen plenty of timers of that style fail in the refrigeration systems at work.
Should blow a fuse
This was also my thought and I tossed it out. I hadn’t thought about the converter shutting itself down instead. I guess that explains the “constant 12v” leg crashing too. I officially learned two things today!
I also agree as the timer is a frivolous feature. Lazy way would be just tying the Green wire to the Blue. More complex would be to wire up another relay in the timer spot. Depends on the load on that DC excite lead(blue wire)? It’s probably just a relay in there anyway.
From what I understand its Unusual to see one fail intermittently.
Heh- Yeah. Being all potted up I agree.
I was referring to what might be in the DC/DC that is doing the keyed switching. My low tech brain just said “relay” but wasn’t being clear.
Do you see any reason he couldn’t do a jump from the Green to Blue wires?
I rolled the dice snd decided to order one. Hate to get towed home again. A Gem parts supplier had it for $105.00. Googled the exact part number off of the timer and found it for $60.59 through a place named Gordon electric supply. Hope I didn’t make another mistake because it looks slightly different in their photo. Theirs doesn’t have the dial to adjust the time. I really don’t care if it’s not adjustable. I just want the problem solved. Keeping my fingers crossed. Will update soon in case anyone else comes across this problem.
Nice find. I’d say you did ok.
According to the tech sheet on the available configs:
You needed a KSPSP22B (which is what was on the page you posted). Hopefully this was on the invoice?
Looks like the image they used is the KSPSP35PSD. It has a place for inserting some Tabbed wires (not sure why they used Female for these). It would still work but you would need to add a 100KOhm variable resistor for the added feature of remote adjustment. A tinkerer could figure out what resistor he needed and just plug one in and be done.
Ordered my timer. Their invoice indicated a ship date of Feb 3rd. Contacted company for a tracking number and I was informed that the part would not be shipped out for another 2 weeks. Cancelled order. So much for my bargain find. Found another company that had it for a slightly higher price. Ordered part. Should have it by Sunday. Anxious to see if the new timer solves my problem.
Received and installed my new timer. New one is exactly the same. Works perfect but at this point I do not know if I solved my intermittent problem because it magically fixed itself before my new timer arrived. Now I just have to drive it and keep my fingers crossed that this was it.
Two long trips around the community with no problems since the new timer was installed. I think it’s solved. Wasted a lot of money on a dc to dc converter and a new relay that I didn’t need but still cheaper than having it shipped to a repair shop and paying for them to find the problem. Thanks again to all that helped.
Well my luck ran out and my intermittent (no clunk) problem returned. Now having a much better understanding of a Gem electrical system I pulled out my volt meter and went to work. Once again I’m focused on the green wire that feeds 12 volts to the timer and the relay. The volt meter is showing erratic readings with the voltage fluctuating between 3 and 12 volts. I had previously blamed the timer because I got 12 volts every time I unplugged the green wire from the timer. Yes. I wiggled the s**t out of all of the connections to eliminate the possibility of a bad crimp. This wire feeds 12 volts from the ignition switch but first it passes through the charger. This is nothing more than a safety which prevents someone from driving away while the charger is still plugged in. I have a RFF charger which I now believe is the culprit. Each time I lightly tapped on the charger the volt meter would jump. For now I bypassed the safety and connected the green wire directly to the wire coming from the ignition switch.
R4F chargers are re-branded Quick Charge units. All the ones I’ve seen are the SCO7210 with the 2-digit LCD on the face. Mine even has the manufacturer part number on a sticker on the foot. R4F did once tell me that they have had different versions of their “supercharger” over the years - I’m not sure if they meant that the SCO7210 has evolved over time or that they were previously rebranding the OB7210 at some point.
More information and manuals can be found at the links below.
https://www.quickcharge.com/select-a-charge%20on%20boards.htm
https://www.quickcharge.com/on%20board%20standard%20chargers.htm
RFF is fantastic. They are standing behind their product.
As you are finding out, some electrical gremlins are tough to sort out.
Nice sniffing. It would be interesting to find out if they actually find something.
If it were me, I’d look for a cold solder joint, or dirty contacts on the lockout relay. I’m assuming you checked the external connectors going to this charger?
In addition to checking the voltage in and voltage out on the chargers lock out wires I also tested them with a ohm meter once the charger was removed from the car. Probably wouldn’t have been so bad if it wasn’t an intermittent problem.
Yeah, no kidding. It’s rare to hear about a failure of a Quick Charge on-board charger. As chargers go, they are about as bright as a goldfish, but built like a goddamn tank. The SCO7210, which is what R4F sells, weighs almost 30 lbs.
Sent charger back to Quick Charge and they confirmed a defective lock out relay. RFF said that they never saw one fail before. Just my luck. I’m the first. Unit was repaired at no charge and returned very fast. RFF and Quick Charge were fantastic. Installed unit today and so far no problem. I’m afraid to say it’s repaired because right from the start it was an intermittent problem. It is also possible that I had more than one problem. When this first started everything 12 volts worked but car didn’t move (no clunk). Then more recently everything was dead when it happened. Keeping my fingers crossed because I’m running out of patience and ideas.