Originally posted by @davellringer and his alternate personality @ellringer
One or the other is invited back here to discuss this topic further.
I know this post is a year old, but I have 2005 GEM E2, I have given up on the DeltaQ charger and ordered the MB1210x6 6 bank charger from Quick Charge. Is this similar to what you did or do you still have the 72 volt charger. I was told to leave the DeltaQ in place for the battery charge display… Should I get the remote display from Quick Charge… any other changes necessary?
davellringer:
I was told to leave the DeltaQ in place for the battery charge display
This little bit of info is quite inaccurate.
Be mindful about where you get advice from.
What this means is that you have been given some bad info. You might reconsider taking advice from this other source in the future.
Or perhaps you misunderstood the info in the way it was presented to you?
Here is why-
The DeltaQ charger has nothing to do with the Battery charge display- AKA the State Of Charge display (SOC) on your dash pod. That display gets it’s information from a combination of the motor controller and the Power Distribution Module in the center of the car (PSDM).
The irony in all this has not been missed and lies in your opening statement-
I have given up on the DeltaQ charger and ordered the MB1210x6 6 bank charger from Quick Charge
It sounds like your plan is to have the 6 bank charger connecting directly to your batteries?
On paper this may sound like a good plan but doing this essentially bypasses the PSDM and a key component the SOC display needs to properly function (the shunt).
So, in summary-
The Device you were told needed to stay in place (old DQ) to save function of a device you wanted to save(SOC Display) would actually be rendered useless by a suggestion to install an incorrect part (6 bank charger) in place of a charger that you have given up on (old DQ) but still had to carry around.
Do I have that right?
Start Over-
Perhaps we need to back up a bit, sit down and start over. We can still fix this.
What seems to be the problem with the old DQ? Can you give details as to why you have lost faith in it?
What is the car status?
Have you already ordered and received the new charger? Installed?
OK, here is the whole story, I have had the 2005 GEM E2 for almost a year, driving it every day for two thousand miles without a hiccup… On January 26 the Gem died on the way to horseshoes, (I didn’t check it at the time, because I didn’t have a voltmeter, but apparently, the batteries were depleted, even though the display showed fully charged.) since then, it was in the shop for two weeks and they told me they couldn’t fix it… had a friend help me trailer it to my garage, where a friend of a friend was going to do his magic, He still hasn’t showed. In the meantime I found the Gem troubleshooting section, followed the process and finally got a 15 error code which states the batteries were below 68.3 volts. when charging the batteries I found one battery with a corroded/melted terminal (the shop apparently didn’t see this). The battery still charged, but I had it replaced anyway ($280). When I tried the DeltaQ charger, it faulted with the blinking red light indicating the voltage was out of range… I took the Gem on an extended drive, and the next charge was a green light, thought my problem was solved, but can’t get the DeltaQ to repeat a successful charge after three more attempts of charging the batteries individually, So charging the batteries individually works, and based on my limited research, the six bank Quick Charge was a recommended approach. I have ordered the Quick Charge six ($800), awaiting it’s arrival next week. Still open for suggestions, but I can’t find anyone here in southern Arizona that wants to help…
On a related note, sorry about the double profiles, but I couldn’t figure out how to delete one.
OK, This is the way to start a proper trouble ticket! Thanks for the backstory.
What shop did you first take it to? Let’s make sure we take them off the list!
Why didn’t you consider having your Delta Q looked at/serviced/replaced? This would probably be the easiest path to getting your car back to normal. What is the status of this charger right now? It could be as simple as another bad/dirty/intermittent connection. Did you notice if it was blinking any other codes?
Hopefully you have acquired some sort of meter to do further diagnostics? It comes in real handy on other repairs too.
FYI - The original melted battery terminal was most likely from a loose connection. Hopefully, you have gone through all of your other connections with a clean and tighten routine. Don’t skimp on this! Tight and Bright it the rule of Rodney!
Hopefully you read and understand the issues that hooking up the 6 bank system will cause. If you REALLY wanted to continue this path there is no real need to leave the old DQ in place other than the charger interlock. This disables the car when charging so you don’t drive away and rip the cord out of the socket. This is easy enough to bypass so your car will still drive but you lose that feature unless your new charger can be adapted with some creative wiring.
A quick look finds this used one on Ebay. It claims to be in working condition. It even seems to have a Ser# suitable for reprogramming (when you decide to make the move to Lithium) $300 + shipping.
The only code from the DQ is two red blinks, voltage out of range, one published remedy is to charge the batteries individually.
Snagged a auto ranging multimeter off Amazon and a 3 Amp charger from Autozone.
Found no other loose wires, charged individually with cables off initially (based on limited research), and last three individual charges with cables on. I think it makes a difference with them off, but I didn’t want to argue and it was less painful. .
I do not understand the issues of installing the six bank, other than research saying it’s the way the batteries should be charged.
I’ve seen the new and used DQ’s but was convinced the six bank was the way to go. Nobody close wants to touch it and Tucson Golf Cars would rather not, $115/hr plus $50 pickup, they whined that parts were hard to find and expensive and they would just start replacing parts to find a fix. I made an educated (intellectually stupid) decision and went with the six bank and all my problems are solved. Hey we have a motor, a battery, and a charger, problemo solved.
I’m a 77 year old retired fuk that just wants it to work like it has, maintenance free for the last year.
Your turn please.
The only code from the DQ is two red blinks, voltage out of range, one published remedy is to charge the batteries individually.
Yes- That is standard OP if the batteries have dropped below the lower Voltage Threshold to be recognized by the charger. The problem is, you should not be going this low. It damages the batteries.
Perhaps the problem lies in the condition of your batteries?
How old are your batteries?
What type are they? Lead acid/Gel?
What size (Group 31?)
If you plug the car in right now see if the stock charger will go through a charge cycle.
I do not understand the issues of installing the six bank
By charging individually you are bypassing the standard charge loop the Battery Display uses to determine the status of the batteries. You will confuse this component and it will forever read empty (since it does not see that you are charging it with your 6 bank.)
just wants it to work like it has, maintenance free for the last year.
You realize this car is 17 years old, Yes? You will eventually need to work on something. Even brand new cars need to be taken into the shop for something every now and then. Especially if driven every day and logging 2000 miles in a year. Reading this again makes me think your motor may be about due for a clean out and service. Yes- these electric cars are NOT maintenance free.
I made an educated (intellectually stupid) decision
Hey- don’t be so hard on yourself. We have all gone down odd paths of misdirection. Blame it on your blood pressure medicine/liver pills/the hot sexy maid that comes in on Tuesdays.
The batteries are MixTech EGM XCL-31S , five are less than a year old, one is new.
I believe the two red blink error were because the batteries were full up…
after some discharging the DQ went thru its’s normal charging lite sequence and t got the solid green light, I then went on a 20 mile ride with my grandson and on the way back the cart started to slow (still 6 bars), which it never does, we made it home, the charger faults with same error, and when I checked the batteries they were all approx 12.3 volts and the autozone charger started at 52% on all of them… The DQ still faulted before and after running them down… On the most recent individual recharge 4 batteries were at 52%, and the back two were at 67 and 82%, 12.5 and 12.6 volts…
I just plugged the DQ in and I did not get the double red blinks and appears to be going thru a normal charge cycle, display was at seven bars… after about 15 minutes I get the double red blink again and the display shows fully charged. I restarted it again, and it went thru the same yellow lite sequence over a two hour period, followed by the flashing green, (I have been monitoring the voltage on one of the batteries and it has gone from 13 to 15.4 volts?, I checked couple others and they were at 14.3), I pulled the plug at this point (approx 5 hours) the battery that was at 15.6 was now 13.8. The AZ battery charger said it was 95%. I have a party to take it too tomorrow and will give it another try… Any suggestions…
Do you have a recommendation on where to get the motor cleaned and serviced?
Almost think it is a microsoft product, like trying the same thing and getting different results!
I believe the two red blink error were because the batteries were full up
A V check across the entire pack at time of error would verify this.
Do you know how to check what profile the charger is set to?
I have many thoughts and have more coming after I sort out details of your last report.
Before you set out today do a V check on your batteries to see where they are all after their 5 hour soak and overnight cool down. You might even try the DQ again and give them another hit before you go.
Monitor your distance traveled and see how they are when you return.
I believe he has checked them to death. Limp along with discrete charging or get a new set of ev batteries. IMHO
Dq charger is fine. It is smart enough to know batteries are not correct.
A V check across the entire pack at time of error would verify this.
Tell me how and where ro do this
Do you know how to check what profile the charger is set to?
No…
Will report back on the individual voltage check and try the DQ sequence again…
Thanks…
Please be brutally honest INWO…
I’m at my three post limit, so I am editing an existing post.
Voltage check results
12.95, 13.01, 13.15, 12.75, 12.98, 12.9…
DQ restarted… red lite fault after 20 minutes, restart again, red light immediately, will measure and charge again after my trip today.
Btw: The Quick Charger is now on hold…
Thanks again…
Total Pack V check: = 73.5
See that battery at 12.75? dropped to 12.33 after six miles to Safeway and back The battery at 12.95 dropped to 12.5
After the Safeway trip I let it cool and plugged the DQ. it was at the flashing green for over an hour and I stopped it to go to the party. Trip 2 results after six miles
See that battery at 12.75?
Next time out, hook your meter on that one and watch it when you drive.
How far does it drop? 13.11 to 12.44 which equates to 62%
Look at it again when you get home from your drive.
Compare it to the new one you just installed. 13.52 to 12.64 = 85%
The other four batteries were at 13.9 dropping tp 12.5 =72% Total voltage 78.4 to 73.7 after six miles…
I am charging the 62% battery to 72% and will wait till things cool to plug the DQ and let it go all night, if the lights are right. It took four hours with the AZ charger to charge it from 62-71%
Make any sense out of this. any other suggestions…
Thinking the DQ was faulting because of the imbalance?
The DQ charger has been on for two hours and the green light is flashing, hoping it’s solid in the am, but It appears to be working, should have left the battery at 62 to see if it red lighted , but I will have another chance tomorrow. but we may be on to something. Thanks for your help…
What are the chances of two faulty batteries, looks like the new battery is fine, actually too good almost.
I hesitate to be brutally honest, maybe @AssyRequired is not afraid to hurt feelings.
This is not complicated. As per usual, should have asked here before spending good money after bad.
Yeah, Ok. I get it.
It’s just the way I try to fully step into the situation before coming to a grand conclusion.
He may have checked them already, But as much as I have been reading lately I sometimes miss some things and I have to plug it back into my brain again.
I can hear the Fat Lady singing off stage so I AM getting to a point here.
Plus, I like to spout off all this info to make it seem like I am smarter than I actually am.
Total Pack V check:
On your 05 a convenient place to pick this up would be in front, under hood, on top of controller, Two cable connections closes to the firewall. They are marked Pos and Neg. You will need Key ON to do this.
Check charge profile:
Switch off master power switch.
Plug in car to charge.
DQ will do a boot/check sequence, then instead of going to charge it will start to flash a code. Count the flashes. A double digit code will have a brief pause between the digits, then repeat. Example: blink… blink, blink, blink… blink… blink, blink, blink would be code 13. It will repeat this sequence several times and end up with a Red2 because it doesn’t see a valid battery.
See that battery at 12.75?
Next time out, hook your meter on that one and watch it when you drive.
How far does it drop?
Look at it again when you get home from your drive.
Compare it to the new one you just installed.
You MIGHT get lucky if you put your AZ charger on it for a day.
Possibly, depending on the battery. My 73v or 77v battery should charge pretty well with any 72v charger. 94ah and more money.
A 2005 should handle the high voltage batteries fine, but do need charger programming.
Is long range needed? Do you need it drop in ready?
3/28 update.
Solid green light this morning.
Voltage before and after 11 mile round trip.
total 75.9 – 71.7
12.99 – 12.19 (this is the 12.75 guy)
13.14 --12.4 (new guy)
12.93 --12.21
12.84 – 12.2
the two in the back were 12.19 and 12.22 after .
Still need to check the DQ profile. (great mounting location GEM)
looking like things are back in balance, except for the new guy.
I will continue to monitor.
Quick Charge order is on hold/cancel.
Thanks again for all your suggestions to turn this around.
