Fututre public charging stations

Electric Car Production
#1

Hello all;

We are a group of MBA students preparing a bussiness model for a net of charging stations located on malls, mega stores, offices, etc.

We’d like to cunsult with you regarding the target price of a typical charge, comared to the home-supplied electricity on one hand, and to the fuel price on the other.

Who will be prepared to pay more than the electricity costs (lets say twice) and still about a half of the fuel price for the same range?

Who will be prepared to pay only the price of the electricicy?

Who will be prepared to pay more, or the same price, of the fuel?

Thanks all.

Martin.

#2

I think people that are paying at the “pump” so to speak would be ldeal with paying more of a toll than a lump sum for the power… electricity costs almost nothing to produce… I could see paying maybe a standard fee of something like $10 so that it fully charges you and the money that is extra made by the station goes toward upkeep and property maintainance. (solar panels to refill depleated energy, and there are other means of producing current as well in green and easy ways)

$10 wouldn’t be a bad price to pay for something away from the home and still be able to stay on the go.

keep it a flat fee to cover costs… that way we wont have competeing gas stations on 3 of four corners at an intersection with different prices…

simplify, no need to make it harder than it has to be…

#3

The system we’ve thinking about is based on a monthly/anual subscription/fee, and the car will be automatically idenfied by some kind of wireless ID technology. Still, we need to decide what should be a reasonable cost for each carge.

Thanks for your help.

#4

[QUOTE=Martin;828]The system we’ve thinking about is based on a monthly/anual subscription/fee, and the car will be automatically idenfied by some kind of wireless ID technology. Still, we need to decide what should be a reasonable cost for each carge.

Thanks for your help.[/QUOTE]

that is also a good idea… like have different companys have different ID cards. then charge per use to that company but then the company pays the station XXX% of the use and that way its all covered…

I dont think its right to have a wireless ID for the car specifically that gets a little weird…

but if you want to look at existing technology with that, then look at the i-pass (aka illinois pass) it charges $xx ammount of money for tolls that you can go through express lanes and just simply have that in the windshield and it will automatically deduct that money from a credited account and your good to go. no need to stop on the highway for tolls.

#5

Sadly, there is often little correlation between what people say they would pay for something, and what they actually will pay in a real world situation.

When I was working up a cost analysis prior to leasing my EV-1, cost of charging was a factor. Ostensibly “free” – once I’d paid $1,200 to have the charger installed at my home. When I figured 3 charges a week for ten years (dopey optimist!), it was under a dollar a charge (even taking cost of electricity into account) which was fine.

Then one day I had a ‘real world’ situation: I was on the road, [U]really[/U] needed a charge, and the only charger nearby was in a private parking lot that was charging $10 admission to get to their ‘free’ charger. I just didn’t want to do that. There was a Costco with a truly free charger ten miles away, so I went for it, and arrived with about .01 km of range left.

So if that ‘free’ garage charger had been $4 or $5: sure. $7 or $8: I don’t know. But that was back when gasoline was ‘only’ $1.50 a gallon, so I might be open to more. Love to have a chance to find out. Hope you’ll share the results of your research.

#6

[QUOTE=John Bear;925]Sadly, there is often little correlation between what people say they would pay for something, and what they actually will pay in a real world situation.

When I was working up a cost analysis prior to leasing my EV-1, cost of charging was a factor. Ostensibly “free” – once I’d paid $1,200 to have the charger installed at my home. When I figured 3 charges a week for ten years (dopey optimist!), it was under a dollar a charge (even taking cost of electricity into account) which was fine.

Then one day I had a ‘real world’ situation: I was on the road, [U]really[/U] needed a charge, and the only charger nearby was in a private parking lot that was charging $10 admission to get to their ‘free’ charger. I just didn’t want to do that. There was a Costco with a truly free charger ten miles away, so I went for it, and arrived with about .01 km of range left.

So if that ‘free’ garage charger had been $4 or $5: sure. $7 or $8: I don’t know. But that was back when gasoline was ‘only’ $1.50 a gallon, so I might be open to more. Love to have a chance to find out. Hope you’ll share the results of your research.[/QUOTE]

wow i never reailzed that they had “free stations” that you had to basicly pay a parking fee… personally if the towns were smart they should all encourage the use of EV’s and have charging stations in a few locations per town for free to make their town try to get more people using EV’s and ranking their town higher among others. then again… thats if they were smart…:rolleyes:

#7

Local, City, State and National government buildings should all have a charging station required by law. A small fee with a number of coins or some VISA like charge card to cover cost of installation and electricity.

Imagine if all libraries, city hall, police stations, book depositories, DMV, etc has a charging station; range around town is not a big issue any more. Get your government going to provide this.

If your shopping malls and work locations, churches and schools have charging stations, life is good.

#8

Good idea, how about if we all send such a request to our local, State & National representatives, all at the same time , for effect?

#9

Assuming we are talking about fast charges. I would pay $10 for a 10 min charge to full capasity. At home I would have to wait for 6-8 hrs on 220 and 12 hrs on 110. To charge faster on the road would be an advantage rather than pulling into Wal-mart and wait 12 hrs.

#10

Are fast 10 minute charges possible with lead acid batteries?

#11

The Max I would say in a “Real World Situation” is again as stated no more than $5 fast charge because I know down the road there is a charge that will get me home for free and then ill just fulll charge when home. People dont have gas stations at home so you cant even compare a gas stations prices to electronics.

#12

[QUOTE=JSRacer;3597]Are fast 10 minute charges possible with lead acid batteries?[/QUOTE]

No. You would need a little more time than that. There is a new company out of Joliet, Il that has a Lead Acid battery that if it really ships will do wonders for the EV market. The second generation can also fast charge!!!:slight_smile:

#13

I could see something like a parking meter where .25c gets you an hour of charging. I pay .13/KW/HR at home so paying essentially double seems fair. Paying .50c per hour seems expensive compaired to home. I would actively avoid paying more than a dollar/hr. To compare to gas where 2 gals at $4.00 gets you 50 miles. I am currently paying $1.30 to go the same distance. That is .13c at 1KW/hr for 10 hours OR 2kw/hr for 5 hours for a total of 10kw. I would avoid paying more than double even though it is substantially less than even current low gas prices.

#14

[QUOTE=JSRacer;3597]Are fast 10 minute charges possible with lead acid batteries?[/QUOTE]

Nope. Wrong technology. For Lithium-Ion, a big challenge for the design is managing the heat for fast chargine. Toyota uses refrigerant from the a/c to cool their battery pack.

#15

The system we’ve thinking about is based on a monthly/anual subscription/fee, and the car will be automatically idenfied by some kind of wireless ID technology. Still, we need to decide what should be a reasonable cost for each carge.

#16

[QUOTE=Engineer_Bill;6452]I could see something like a parking meter where .25c gets you an hour of charging. I pay .13/KW/HR at home so paying essentially double seems fair. compaired to home. I would actively avoid

#17

Martin,
Charging stations are paramount in importance in travel with any vehicle! Our society presently is hooked on gas and the gas charging stations are not located in “We are a group of MBA students preparing a bussiness model for a net of charging stations located on malls, mega stores, offices, etc.” The probability of electric charging for these type vehicles will be at home. Charging stations for electric vehicles are needed on or near major highways and it needs to be in the form of quick chargers (DC).

#18

Renewable Tech Consultant

The independent power producer for EVs can charge by Kwhs, Minutes, or Monthly Unlimited prepay with no restrictions.

The EV market is moving toward fast and convenience commercial charging infrastructure, free charging station access is limited, unreliable and will end soon.
All EV drivers are now paying to charge their EVs while at home, so why should commercial and public charging be free? The EV charging station industry is an environmentally concise revenue stream for commercial and public EV charging station owners. The EV charging station owners are interested in recovering their cost or generating a profit for operating EV charging stations.

If you need further help contact me

#19

Late last night, I got an e-mail from Chargemaster regarding CYC points added onto the Polar plus network. Within the e-mail, there were two links. I clicked onto one of them and discovered that if I charge my car at near by shopping mall will cost me 9p/kwh plus VAT.
I called Chargemaster this morning and ask when will the price take effective. They told me today. I also ask her, how would I be ‘billed’. She said, they will send out monthly bills and money will be taken in 2-3 days.
I realized that Source London will charge a membership fee at 4 pounds per month starting January 2017. Their fees are calculated per minute to prevent user hugging the charging station. The cost is 3.6p per minute or 2.16 pounds per hour.
I hate to tell them that people will not use these stations if the petrol price is below 1.50/litre because its cheaper to buy petrol.

#20

There is a need to “re-educate” the driving public because we are all used to a pay at the pump system. As the cost of electricity is minimal compared to the cost of petrol/gasoline people might feel they are getting ripped off by the EV charging companies. However, people forget the massive investment required as well as the ongoing costs. Once this is fully explained to the motoring public this should reduce resistance to change?