Making thread public.
Sorry - just saw this after I posted on the forum. Just trying to understand which options is best etc.
The Volt sounds complicated, but guessing it could be far cheaper than the others. Can find a better, but would need the components from you tp make out work - rough cost?
The Lifepo4 sounds very easy, but trying to understand if 35 cells (think I can squash 7 packs of them in) have enough power? Not sure what cost wof this would be to get it up running plug and play style
The Bolt sounds best, most expensive - may well be worth it, but just trying to figure out if it is overkill for my needs. Your pricing on battery sounds fine. Just don;t know what else I need on the fab side to get it done.
Sorry for all the annoying questions - just want to fix it once and get it running right for my wife. Appreciate your guidance.
Stewart
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On Jun 21, 2019, at 1:35 PM, Inwo via Electric Forum electricforum@discoursemail.com wrote:
June 21Hi, I don’t want to cut prices on the forum, as I’ve sold a few.
I will make it ready to go with Bluetooth wired, for $3500 plus shipping.
If you know someone with a business account, you might save on ups or fedex.
Dave
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Volt is the best bang for the buck, but the best priced ones are Gen1 2012 - 2013.
Even the new ones from #*&?@^ are not much newer.
Do not buy a 72v Volt battery on Ebay scam. They are 18s and 66v nominal. Will not work in a Gem.
Ask around on the forum. See what others decided. As I sell stuff, I can’t give an unbiased answer. I like whatever I have now! 
Inwo,
Been thinking it through and I think lifepo4 is the best solution for me - simple. While I like the bolt solution, probably coming in at 4K when all said and done and that is probably more than I need.
So what would I need and what would the cost be to buy everything I needed form you for a lifepo4 system? Currently run72 v system, so could do that or upgrade to 96v (preferred). Assume I need a new charger to go with this - do I need a band or can you bottom balance before you send?
Stewart
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On Jun 21, 2019, at 4:11 PM, Inwo via Electric Forum electricforum@discoursemail.com wrote:
June 21Volt is the best bang for the buck, but the best priced ones are Gen1 2012 - 2013.
Even the new ones from Crazy Allen are not much newer.
Do not buy a 72v Volt battery on Ebay scam. They are 18s and 66v nominal. Will not work in a Gem.
Ask around on the forum. See what others decided. As I sell stuff, I can’t give an unbiased answer. I like whatever I have now!
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Cells are $50 each. 25 is about 80v and stock charger should work. $50 I’ll put shunt balancers on. Helps keep from over charging.
Nothing else needed except shipping.
Any more you need lithium charger.
I would try 25. You can always add more.
Or 50 for twice the miles. $2500
Price sounds great.
If I could fit 50 I would, but don’t think I can. Out of interest, what is the next increment up from the 25 (recall they had to be a multiple of something).
At 25 - that will be 80v and what amph? In your experience will I see a performance upgrade in comparison to the 72v lead I have been running?
Stewart
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On Jul 1, 2019, at 2:32 PM, Inwo via Electric Forum electricforum@discoursemail.com wrote:
July 1Cells are $50 each. 25 is about 80v and stock charger should work. $50 I’ll put shunt balancers on. Helps keep from over charging.
Nothing else needed except shipping.
Any more you need lithium charger.
I would try 25. You can always add more.
Or 50 for twice the miles. $2500
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Yes, you lose a lot of weight.
Only 60ah and the Gem pushes the limits of a single set.
Well worth your trouble if you can squeeze in 50 cells. How about two layers?
Once someone figures it out everyone will do it.
Need multiples of 25. At least 24s for 72v.
I think if I were going to try and squash in 50, that at that point I would just go Bolt battery for $3500 and be done with it. Was hoping the lifepo4 was a viable alternative at a cheaper price point - some of the feedback on the forums make the lifepo4 sound great, but your response sounded less confident than them?
Would it help if I went to 28? Think I read a thread by “kinghappy” where you built him a 28s system on these green cells and apparently the cart went fast and far. Were those the same batteries as these or were those different?
To be clear, my concern is I drive around with people in the cart most of the time - three or four kids and my wife - and want to ensure what I am spending gets me the bang I am looking for. Don’t need a hot-rod per se, but would really like a cart that would easily handle the hills in our little town without bogging down and that could go for 15-20 miles without a concern.
Will 25-28 cells do that, or am I looking beyond what this particular set up can do? Again, like the lifepo4 because it is fast and simple, doesn’t need a bms, etc. but maybe I am just barking up the wrong tree on that solution.
Stewart
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On Jul 1, 2019, at 3:47 PM, Inwo via Electric Forum electricforum@discoursemail.com wrote:
July 1Yes, you lose a lot of weight.
Only 60ah and the Gem pushes the limits of a single set.
Well worth your trouble if you can squeeze in 50 cells. How about two layers?
Once someone figures it out everyone will do it.
Need multiples of 25. At least 24s for 72v.
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I think 25-28 will be fine. Those who did it are very happy. Easy and not a lot of money.
My concern is that batteries are at the limit of rated 5c current. Which is 300amps.
I very rarely exceed 300 amps, and doubt if others do either. So for all but hot-rodders a single set seems fine.
25 or 28, only difference is the charger and most want a lithium charger either way.
Cells are 3.2v nominal. Figure 3.5v max needed. 3.7 won’t hurt them, but little gained from over charging.
28s at 3.5 is 98v. That’s pretty hot. Pick anything in between 24-28.
Sorry for the delayed response, was on vacation with the family.
I think the 28s will be great for me - help with the hills a little and the weight of the family. Sounds like a simple install, and I know they will fit.
I have a Delta Q charger - hopefully that can be reprogrammed, but if not, will need a new charger.
Would it be possible (happy to pay you for it) to have the shunt installed and the cells balanced etc before you send them (or is that not possible?) think you said you could add the shunt for $50, but don’t know about balancing etc. - looking for as simple a plug and play as possible.
I believe it was $50 per cell, so $1400 for 28, plus $50 for the shunts - cost for shipping to 90245 and for balancing? If my charger can be reprogrammed, what would the cost be, and if it cannot, what is the cost of a new charger?
Excited to get this done. Let me know how we handle payment etc.
Stewart
All correct.
About $100 shipping. (heavy)
I can have them balanced and assembled in 2 x 5s modules and 3 6s.
If charger is DQCP with a big black dot or DQCT and above numbers, good to go programming.
$50 plus shipping both ways.
Or a new charger is $300 set to 28s.
Batteries have been on the shelf a while, so it will take a couple days to rebalance and assemble them.
I can get started right away. It’s a good package even if you change your mind.
$1550 delivered for batteries.
Plus $50 or $300 for charger.
Send friends and family or add 5% for fees.
Also send $1 payment for goods. (to print labels)
I found 28 matched cells on the shelf. None have self discharged in the last month, so they are good to go after banding and putting on the shunt balancers.
Ps.
They bolt on each cell easily in any order. Safer to ship them loose.
Awesome.
Attached is a pic of my charger - Quin 7212 by delta-q. I looked it up and appears rated only for lead acid.
I am assuming this means I need a new charger, but thought I would ask you before I made a $300 assumption!
Stewart
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On Jul 9, 2019, at 2:43 PM, Inwo via Electric Forum electricforum@discoursemail.com wrote:
July 9$1550 delivered for batteries.
Plus $50 or $300 for charger.
Pay David Bissen using PayPal.Me
Go to paypal.me/INWO and type in the amount. Since it’s PayPal, it’s easy and secure. Don’t have a PayPal account? No worries.
I found 28 matched cells on the shelf. Non have self discharged in the last month, so they are good to go after banding and putting on the shunt balancers.
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Can’t tell from that. Look for a DQCP on the flange.
David,
Looked last night and could not find those letters. Sent $1850.00 this morning, including the $300 for the new programed charger.
Stewart
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On Jul 9, 2019, at 4:27 PM, Inwo via Electric Forum electricforum@discoursemail.com wrote:
July 9Can’t tell from that. Look for a DQCP on the flange.
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Ok, time for me to get to work.
Dave
Now 88v. After charging to 3.5v (90%) and draining each cell 68ah they are near empty. (10%)
Yes, all >70ah @ 10a rate.
Next up- charger.
Notice the DQCM on the flange?
