The company claims a 40 km range, but I suppose that’s if you weigh 60 kg and go steadily at 20 km/h.
My experience has been that the range is considerably lower at about 25 km. I can probably go further, but at much lower speeds.
What I need to do is extend the range of this scooter somehow. It currently has four 12V 20A SLA batteries as far as I know.
I’ve been told that in order to get an extended range, I’d have to add a second set of four. The best way would be to probably replace the type of batteries on the scooter.
I thought about another solution. What if I used four 7,2V 3850Mah battery packs connected in parallel to give me a total of 15,4 A and then connect that pack to the current one in a series.
Currently the system is 48V so if I add 7,2V it would be 55,2V and probably put a little bit more strain on the electric engine. I saw a video on YouTube where this one guy did something similar with his Xebra and had a switch that would apply the higher voltage to the system but said that he only used it at higher speeds to gain additional speed.
I can get the scooter to go about 37 km/h. It would be nice if it could go 10 km/h faster and since I’d be going faster, I could also go a bit further.
ounds about right, but from the sound of it it sounds like it would be maxing out the motor… motors are only so good for specific speeds for so much time… if you go above the “suggested” speed for too much time you have a possibility of overheating the motor…
Just so I’m on the same page, do you know what kind of motor you’ll be using in this application? It seems that you might want to go with a combination of batteries that are in a series as well as packs in parallel. This would give the burst of speed when needed and the range as well but you’ll need to build a circuit that is able to switch between the different packs as required.
A123 Cells are, unfortunately, out of the question. I calculated that I’d need about 135 of those babies, which would run me well over $2000 and the cost per km just doesn’t add up. Needless to say, they are impressive.
I would, however, consider using those to power the lights on the scooter.
[QUOTE=pmrozik;374]A123 Cells are, unfortunately, out of the question. I calculated that I’d need about 135 of those babies, which would run me well over $2000 and the cost per km just doesn’t add up. Needless to say, they are impressive.
I would, however, consider using those to power the lights on the scooter.[/QUOTE]
Cost, unfortunately, is the biggest factor when we do these projects. I’m pretty sure the average person doesn’t have $2000.00 just sitting around for batteries but the prices are dropping and they should be more affordable as progress is made.
The idea you have with using them to power lights and other such sounds like a sound one. A multi-type battery system might be the key to this for the hobbyist.
Being that you’re using a 500 watt 48V brushless motor, the A123 batteries might not work for this application. Have you considered using 6v batteries? I know that you might not get the greatest acceleration but you might be able to get the distance you’re looking for.
You also have to be careful mixing different types of batteries. You can wind up with one type of battery constantly trying to charge the other type. This is the same reason you almost always see battery packs made up of the same type, brand, model, and age of battery.
[QUOTE=Lazlow;384]You also have to be careful mixing different types of batteries. You can wind up with one type of battery constantly trying to charge the other type. This is the same reason you almost always see battery packs made up of the same type, brand, model, and age of battery.[/QUOTE]
Very true. I would recommend using the battery packs separately which also means they would have to be charged separately with two different charges. There is nothing like a battery explosion…kind of nasty. But all in all, it will work if they’re separated just add some additional time to charge if you use a single circuit to split the current to charge two difference types of batteries or minus some charging time if you use two separate chargers.
[QUOTE=lstockman;380]
Being that you’re using a 500 watt 48V brushless motor, the A123 batteries might not work for this application. Have you considered using 6v batteries? I know that you might not get the greatest acceleration but you might be able to get the distance you’re looking for.[/QUOTE]
Thanks a lot for your answer.
I don’t think I know enough about the way electricity works in order to even consider that. Acceleration is important when I’m on the city streets, but running of out juice is much worse than having bad acceleration. I saw some 3300 mAh 7.2V NiMH battery packs for a pretty low price ($25). Are you saying that I could connect these in parallel and run the motor at 7.2V? Would the scooter achieve a similar speed?
[QUOTE=Lazlow;384]You also have to be careful mixing different types of batteries. You can wind up with one type of battery constantly trying to charge the other type. This is the same reason you almost always see battery packs made up of the same type, brand, model, and age of battery.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, you’re right. I thought about installing a switch which would allow me to use one of the battery packs.
I don’t think I know enough about the way electricity works in order to even consider that. Acceleration is important when I’m on the city streets, but running of out juice is much worse than having bad acceleration. I saw some 3300 mAh 7.2V NiMH battery packs for a pretty low price ($25). Are you saying that I could connect these in parallel and run the motor at 7.2V? Would the scooter achieve a similar speed?[/QUOTE]
Well, to increase range, one would want to run the batteries in parallel strings as this will increase the amp per hour capacity of the battery pack. To get fast acceleration, one would want to wire the batteries in series but one can expect to receive a lower amp/hour in the battery pack but could haul butt depending on the motor.
Don’t expect a huge burst of acceleration but do expect longer distances. Mixing the two types is achievable especially if one is using the same type of batteries. You could use 4 batteries in series for the bursts of speed that you need and then the rest in series to get the distance. You would need to have a circuit to change between the packs as you don’t want to use both packs at the same time as this would only waste much needed amps.
Don’t expect a huge burst of acceleration but do expect longer distances. Mixing the two types is achievable especially if one is using the same type of batteries. You could use 4 batteries in series for the bursts of speed that you need and then the rest in series to get the distance. You would need to have a circuit to change between the packs as you don’t want to use both packs at the same time as this would only waste much needed amps.
Okay, l admit I’m a bit confused. I fully understand how batteries work in series and in parallel, but now I’m considering the following solution:
Keep the 12V SLA batteries on board for a total of 48V and 20 A.
Add four 3300Ah 7.2V battery backs and connect them in parallel for a total of 13.2A for starters.
Now how about this for driving:
I go from 0-30 km/h on the SLA batteries, and switch to the 13.2A 7.2V pack once I’m going 30 km/h. Will I be able to maintain that speed at such low voltage?
I was checking out ebay yesterday and there are allot of good deals on theese batteries I only wish they were making 6 volt lantern batteries in NIMH, They would be easier to adapt to the car. LOL But you might be able to make something for your scooter with theese and I thought they were reasonably priced, when I bought my camera in 2000 they were selling for about $25.00 for four AA batteries. I looked for them in 12 volt batteries but the ones I found were too expensive for me. I found them in Canada and the cost for my pack would have been around 10,000 dollars american.
Ok if I understand how it all works… this would work for ya…
Run the stock 48V 20A pack. Add one 12V 20A batteries wired to a contactor Like this…
(sorry for the lack of quality I made it in Paint real quick)
The contactor would have 2 positins and in effect change your battery pack between 48V 25A and 60V 20A. I have no Idea where or even if you can get a contactor that will do that, you might have to build your own contactor. I also have no Idea what that will do the the batteries as far as discharging unevenly. You would most likely have to get a 60V charger and charge the pack in the 60V 20A configuration or disconect the contactor and wire it stock for 48V charging and charge the extra battery seperate.
You might also be able to add a 5th battery and wire it series so you always run 60V 20A and just run the scooter at the 37Km/h you get at 48V. I am not sure if that would over heat the motor ??
If you went back to just extending the range, you have two choices as I see it. Either add another 4 12V 20A batteries and wire all eight parallel in banks of two so you get four 12V 40A banks then wire all the banks in series and you have 48V 40A almost double the range you have now minus a bit for the added weight. Choice 2 would be pull out the whole stock battery pack and put 4 new batteries in with higher AH raitings wired in series.
As I previewed my post I realized this thread hasnt been posted on in 2 months LOL but I wrote all that so it went up there anyway… Maybe someone can use it or please let me know if any of it is wrong I am still learning…
You cannot get more distance without more watt-hours. Your 48 volt 20 amp-hour pack holds a maximum of 960 watt-hours. In the real world this 20-hour rating is bogus. Because you deplete your batteries in maybe 1 hour, you actually get much less capacity out of them.
If you want more range, you need more amp-hours; not more voltage. Add another set of 4 20 amp-hour batteries and double your range (if you discount the added weight).
If you want more acceleration you need more instantaneous amps. You get this by lowering the internal resistance of the battery pack. 2 strings of 4 20 amp-hour batteries in parallel will cut the internal resistance in half as well as giving you twice the range (double the amp-hours).
If you want more speed you have to have more horsepower. A low wattage motor with stock gearing will only go so fast. Change the gearing and you lose acceleration. Go to a higher watt motor and different gearing and you’ll get more top speed with equal acceleration but at the expense of range.
There’s no such thing as a free lunch.
Bob in MA
2002 GEM eL (XD?)
2011 eZip mountain bike
2012 Prius V
it simply just sounds like it would be maximizing out the engine . . . engines are only so good for some of the specific rates of speed for so plenty of your time and effort . . . i mean if you go ahead of the “suggested” speed for too plenty of your time and effort you might be or definitely have a possibility of heating up the engine . . . . . .
